I have an older hot tub that someone did some work on. They replaced the control panel and the heater. The heater is a LeisureBay ap-1400 which seems to be a popular generic replacement control box/heater. Problem is, when standing wet on earth ground and you touch the water in the hot tub, you get a nice jolt. I'm guessing it's only 60-70 volts AC, but haven't tested with a meter. My guess is that the neatrual hot are hooked up incorrectly on the ap-1400, but I have no schematics or hook-up diagram since I was not the installer. It appears this box can be hooked up as either a 110 or 220. I'm wondering if anyone can shed light on this for me. I could be completely wrong about where the electric is coming from, but I have pulled the plug on all other devices and only the ap-1400 has electric to it and I still get shocked.

This is why it's so important to have a GFCI installed somewhere in line with the main power.

The 1400's an easy box to wire up. In the below picture, you'll see that L1, L2, Neutral and Ground are all lined up and indicated with a marker strip right next to the power buss connector.

http://spasupport.com/diagrams/ap1400.jpg

If your wires aren't connected in this fashion, then they need to be changed, with the power turned off of course. But, as always, Use this information at your own risk!; and please get a GFCI installed on that thing. Indeed if it had one, then it would never have let you turn the power on.

Also, be absolutely CERTAIN, that your ground wire is actually GROUNDING! If you've got 3 wire power running to this, then you really need to add a separate ground wire. Be careful with this, good luck and please in the future don't use your hand in the water to test if it's safe!

Thanks for the reply and picture. Looks like that one is a 220, mine is hooked up as a 110. I've checked things out pretty good at this point and I feel as though the box is hooked up correctly. Now I'm guessing there is a pin hole in the heater element causing the problem. I've had the heater element out and checked it out, everything looks good to the eye. There is a GFCI hooked in. There are actually two of them. The outlet I installed for the tub is a GFCI unit. There is also a GFCI connected directly to the main cord leading out of the tub. This is one thing which has puzzled me. I don't understand why it doesn't trip--either of them. I've tried measuring the voltage in the water and best I can tell it jumps between 0 to 10 VAC. It feels like more than 10 VAC though. My meter doesn't log instantaneous voltage changes. The other puzzling thing is that if I move the heater box, the problem goes away. It is only in certain positions that it has a problem.

Sorry for rambling, but just trying to give the facts. I'm just looking for feedback from people with more experience than myself (not hard I have none). What could cause a voltage leak? Is the heater element the only thing that could cause it? Has anyone ever heard of moving the heater box and that causing enough stress on the element to cause a problem? And how can you have a current leak in the water, but the GFCI not trip? My neutral measures nearly 0 ohms to earth ground and I've measured earth ground resistance to the earth ground going into my meter box from the eletric company, that resistance is 0 ohms. I'm planning on replacing the element, but would like some feedback in case it doesn't fix the problem.

Thanks.

With the power removed from the spa, (unplugged).

Disconnect the wires that are attached to the heater element itself, tape them up, then repeat the check again.

Physical inspection of a marginal element will rarely show evidence of cracking or invasion of water. They'll look just bloody wonderful, but yet they've got evidence of micro-size cracking that can only be seen under special circumstances.

If at this time you have no further evidence of stray voltage, then you've certainly found your culprit. As far as the GFCI goes, it really sounds like they're either inactive, defective, or not even connected properly, or just flat worn out. That said, it is very noteworthy to mention that 115 volt style plug in or socketed GFCI's don't have a very long life, especially when they're outside. They fail, and you never know it until you get zapped as you have. The best alternative to this is to use a breaker box mounted 115 volt GFCI, (they're pretty cheap, usually less than 20.00) for the best protection.

One of the best tools for testing GFCI's is a "Wiggy" voltage tester, which can be obtained from Home Depot. Wiggy Volt Meter. All you have to do is place one probe on L1 (hot), and the other one to ground and it will immediately trip the GFCI. If it doesn't, then your GFCI is dead, and you're not protected.

Ok, that was a mouthful, I'll finish it up with this... moving the spa, moving the heater, moving anything with a heater element in it will usually kill the heater element within a few weeks or months. They're just a little sensitive to movement sometimes. It's a problem that I've seen so many times over the years that it's an automatic assumption that anyone that moves or purchases a used spa, etc, will usually have to replace the heater element within the year.

Hope this helps, and let us know how you make out with it.

Thanks.

PS: Here's your heater element if you decide to purchase from us: http://spapartsnet.com/products/EHAE55NINS.html

Thank you very much for your time and expertise. I will post back when I have a final outcome. I appreciate the info on the wiggy, I've been looking for something to test the GFI with. It is brand new and I feel as though my wiring is fine (tested the outlet with a standard outlet checker) but didn't know how to check if the GFI was working properly. I will purchase one and see what happens. I suspected moving the spa was what caused the element to go bad, but nothing to base that assumption on. I will get a GFI breaker box and install as you suggest as well. This is to be mounted outside 5 feet from the spa, correct?

Yes, it must be at least 5 feet away (NO Closer!), and visible to occupants of the tub to be code compliant.

Thanks!

I replaced the heater element and still have the same problem. I did verify my GFCI was working correctly. The Wiggly causes it to reset. I ran an extra grounding rod in next to the hot tub and stuck a copper wire (10 gadge) into the hot tub to see if that would cause the GFCI to trip, and it does not. Yet when you put your hand in the water and standing on earth ground (mostly wet) it will cause a shocking sensation. I'm just really stumped. I'm begining to think the earth is hot and the tub is grounded!

Ok. Well, try this just at least one time...

(this thing really is sounding bizarre to me too!)

With the power off.

Disconnect the two wires going to the heater element, tape them up and see if this problem goes away, moving the heater box etc...

Other question, are there any other devices that are routed to the electrical source for the power (outlet, or otherwise) to the hot tub?

Last thing, if you've got a few pictures of this installation, post them here or send them to image91 at spanet.net (esp if they're larger than say 250k).

Anything, would help!

OK, I taped the two leads going to the element up (disconnected from circuit). Same problem. It is interesting to note that the jets still run with the element out of circuit. I'm wondering if the problem is with the jets somehow, but don't know a thing about how the are wired or where they are wired. I'm going to try and borrow a better multimeter that can measure current and can store peak voltage/amp readings to get a better idea of what I'm dealing with. I took a picture of the inside of my AP-1400 heater box just in case you can see something obviously wired wrong. It all looks good to me, but I'm no expert.

Here's one for you... is there a power connection on this lug? (as depicted below).

Also, the controller doesn't care if it has a heater or not, as everything works independently of it.