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 Post subject: SPA JET HELP!!
PostPosted: Sat Dec 22, 2007 2:56 pm 

Joined: Wed Dec 19, 2007 7:07 pm
Posts: 5
Location: Elkhart, IN
I inherited a free small Emerald Spa hottub. Mod#491-2. Pump Power unit is the ES-2. with only 3 main jets and one back massage and 2 small jets in the whole spa.

When I first filled and started it up all the jets worked. After the first use one side quit working. In the lower photo you will see the jet which doesn't work. This is on the pump/control side of the tub just above the power pack. After numerous bleeding tries with the bleeder valve that I found on top of the filter housing, I don't seem to get any more air bleeding out only water. Yet jet still doesnt blow

The 2 little jets next to it work when the pump is in recirculation mode. But when I turn the jets on the big one and the 2 little ones do not pump water. I have tried turning the ring on the big jet.and it makes no difference. I removed the center of the jet and cleaned it and checked as much as possible for any obstruction and still no luck. I was told the jet may be installed upside down. But, it will only go in one way. Note: the trim rings on the little ones do not control flow, just used to lock knozzle in place. The ring on each big jet controls flow.

The jets on the other side work fine. Each of the two big jets were removed, cleaned and work well. They both can be turned on or off and the amount they are on or off controls the flow out of the center verticle back massage jet.

I have tried shutting off the other two main jets and blocking the blow from the back massage jet hoping to force water or any air pocket out of the other side. But no luck.

Also, no change in the jet when blowers are on and adjusting the blower control knobs.

NOTE: the odd factor is when I stick my finger tip into the big jet knozzle feeling for flow when the jets are on I actually fell a little suction. No change on this with blowers on or off.

The previous owners said they had the same problem. After draining for summer and refilling for winter - all jets would work the first time. But after they were shut off and then back on the one same jet would not flow.

My local spa/pool repair center just gives me a blank look when I go in and describe the issue. They seem clueless on what to do and only want to charge to come and look.

Anybody have any ideas or anyone in my area who can HELP!!!

Thanks
Ricc Havens
Elkhart, IN 46516


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 Post subject:
PostPosted: Mon Dec 24, 2007 5:50 am 

Joined: Fri Sep 03, 2004 12:27 am
Posts: 1153
Location: Albert Lea, MN
If you could, post a photo of the entire top of the tub. Often, tubs have flow control knobs on top of the tub, which control which sets of jets will operate. Also try removing the jet insert on the non-working jet. With the insert removed, there is no physical obstruction possible inside the jet, unless some debris became physically lodged in the center of the housing, behind the insert. With the insert removed, you should be able to inspect to see if this is the case. Try running the tub with the insert removed and see if you have any flow.

Do you have an enormous jet in that tub, besides the large jets, small jets, and back massage jet? If so, check to see if the outer ring is knurled. Often these type of jets (sometimes referred to as whirlpool jets) are also adjustable, but they not only adjust themselves, but other jets in the tub as well.



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 Post subject:
PostPosted: Mon Dec 24, 2007 7:12 am 

Joined: Wed Dec 19, 2007 7:07 pm
Posts: 5
Location: Elkhart, IN
Thanks for the replay. Below is a pic of the controls and also one of the back of the non-working jet. I have tried adjusting the controls in every configuration possible and no difference in jet function but all the others work. Also, I have remove the jet insert and saw no obstruction and when remove I still had no flow. There is no other big jet with knurled ring the only jets are the ones shown. The only other things under water are teh light, skimmer, and suction inlet at the bottom. Are are working properly.

Any other ideas?????

Thanks
Ricc Havens
Elkhart, IN


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 Post subject:
PostPosted: Mon Dec 24, 2007 7:43 am 

Joined: Fri Sep 03, 2004 12:27 am
Posts: 1153
Location: Albert Lea, MN
do you have any other knobs or levers on the top of the tub? Those two white knobs only control the amount of air being drawn into the jets, and have nothing to do with water flow.



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ATTENTION! USE THE ADVISE ON THIS FORUM WISELY! WE ARE NOT LIABLE FOR INJURIES, DEATH, DAMAGE, ETC. ARISING FROM THE USE OF THE INFORMATION IN THIS FORUM!

NOTE: I can't guarentee knowledge of all spas.
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 Post subject:
PostPosted: Mon Dec 24, 2007 8:43 am 

Joined: Wed Dec 19, 2007 7:07 pm
Posts: 5
Location: Elkhart, IN
Nope - no other controls. What you see is all I have.

Ricc Havens
Elkhart, IN


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 Post subject:
PostPosted: Mon Dec 24, 2007 8:54 am 

Joined: Fri Sep 03, 2004 12:27 am
Posts: 1153
Location: Albert Lea, MN
do you have a single, 2 speed pump, or do you have 2, single speed pumps?



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 Post subject:
PostPosted: Mon Dec 24, 2007 9:03 am 

Joined: Wed Dec 19, 2007 7:07 pm
Posts: 5
Location: Elkhart, IN
Just the one pump as seen in the first photo (to the right of the Emerald Spa control panel)


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 Post subject:
PostPosted: Mon Dec 24, 2007 9:53 am 

Joined: Fri Sep 03, 2004 12:27 am
Posts: 1153
Location: Albert Lea, MN
When you said you noticed suction from the non-working jet, were you checking from the bottom of the jet housing where the water comes out, or on the top of the housing? It may be possible that you noticed the suction from one of the working jets' air venturi feeding back on the non-working jet's air venturi. The water portion of the jet body (based on the photo of the back of it) is the bottom side, with the air on the top side.

I'm thinking that a rag or other obstruction somehow ended up in that run of hose, before the jets. When you have the pump on low, it's loose enough to pass some water. But when you engage the pump on high, the obstruction basically seals the line shut.

The way those tubs are plumbed, there is no way for a jet to suck water in. They are discharge only.

Now, what to do? I would try to back flush the obstruction out of the plumbing. This procedure isn't going to be fun, especially depending on where your filter is located. From what I see, it looks like the plumbing comes from the pump, through the heater, and out to the jets. Is this correct? If so, drain the tub, disconnect the flexible hose from the left side of the heater (leaving the gate valve open), and backfeed from that blocked jet. I would try compressed air if you can. You may just find the obstruction come right out. If your filter housing is between the heater and the jets, this could be tricky. Most filter housings are equipped with a bypass valve, which is simply a spring loaded rubber flapper. If this piece broke off (as they often do), this could have gotten lodged in the plumbing. Depending on the design of the housing, you may still be able to backflush into the filter housing, and retrieve the obstruction in the housing. If not, and if you have easy access to the plumbing on the discharge side of the filter housing, on the line going to the non-working jet, I would suggest cutting the line and trying to backfeed to that cut. When all is said and done, use a pvc coupler and flex-pvc cement to repair the line.



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ATTENTION! USE THE ADVISE ON THIS FORUM WISELY! WE ARE NOT LIABLE FOR INJURIES, DEATH, DAMAGE, ETC. ARISING FROM THE USE OF THE INFORMATION IN THIS FORUM!

NOTE: I can't guarentee knowledge of all spas.
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 Post subject:
PostPosted: Mon Dec 24, 2007 10:06 am 

Joined: Fri Sep 03, 2004 12:27 am
Posts: 1153
Location: Albert Lea, MN
I just thought about a couple more ideas regarding how one might get an obstruction out.

If you do have the line running from the heater to the jets, no filter in between, you could try to use a small diameter drain snake and see if you can grab the obstruction that way, or maybe even get a shop vac on the hose, and tape off all but the non-working jet and see if you can suck it out that way.



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ATTENTION! USE THE ADVISE ON THIS FORUM WISELY! WE ARE NOT LIABLE FOR INJURIES, DEATH, DAMAGE, ETC. ARISING FROM THE USE OF THE INFORMATION IN THIS FORUM!

NOTE: I can't guarentee knowledge of all spas.
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 Post subject:
PostPosted: Mon Dec 24, 2007 1:56 pm 

Joined: Wed Dec 19, 2007 7:07 pm
Posts: 5
Location: Elkhart, IN
The filter housing is a round canister housing to the left of the white gate valve on the left of the main box shown in the first photo. It's imounted on a tip out door just to the left of the timer dial and gate valve.

The possibility of a broken backflow flapper valve makes some sense. Becaause I don't see anyway a stray rag could ge sucked into the system since the skimmer and underwater inlet are well covered for large debris.

I guess I'll have to wait till spring to try your suggestions. The ground is frozen so I have no where for the water to go when I drain the tub other than onto my patio where it will make a big puddle then ice rink until spring thaw.


If you think of any other possibilities - please let me know

THANKS
Ricc Havens


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