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John McLaughlin
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Post subject: 2002 Hot Springs Sovereign: Pump/Heat Problems and leaks Posted: Mon Aug 04, 2008 1:42 pm |
Joined: Mon Aug 04, 2008 12:58 pm Posts: 30
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Hey all, been reading this forum for two days now trying to find similar situation. I have seen a few that are close, but not exact. So here goes my situation:
I recently was given a 2002 Hot Springs Sovereign Model IQ. It has all the basic pumps and heater: Fresh Water 3 ozone system, Silent Flo 5000 and Watkins NoFault Electrical heater and then the wavemaster thing. THe electrical of this tub is set up for 220.
On to the issues. Filled the tub up and noticed it leaked, took care of that and found it still leaked, taking care of that soon. Noticed the motomassage unit in the corner didnt move and had little water coming out of it. Took that apart after reading a few posts on here. Found that both the water hose and the air hose were broke. I will be replacing just the hoses and will see if it works then, before replacing the entire jet.
I also noticed that after a day and a half the hot tub was not heatin gproperly, so i started investigating. The heater pipes had lots of condensation on them if that means anything. I also noticed that when filling the tub in the filter area i could feel the cold water coming up through the floor drain if that means anything. I also noticed the Silent Flo pump was extremely hot. I read on an earlier post that you could take this pump apart and clean it and also see if there were any obstructions. I noticed the lines going in and out of the silent Flo pump had water in them, but it didnt look as if it was moving at all. So i am guessing something is goign on inside that pump not sure though.
Another item. I looked at cleaning the ozone system per the manual, with white vinegar. I took the tube out of the bottom the ozonator and stcuk it in the bottle of vinegar. Turned the jets on and expected the ozonator to start sucking the vinegar out. After maybe five minutes, there was no vinegar missing it was still at the top. Not sure what that means at all. Should I expect the process to take days?
One last thing on my leaks, the leaks are a lot worse when the jets are on. In one area that it leaks, is in the corner seat where there are ten or so mini jets. This leak will only drip when the jets arent on, but will leak abundantly when the jets are on. I was told by my parents who gave me the tub that the leak would stop once it was down below the top four mini-jets. Can i deduce that my problem lies within those 4 jets? The other leak (that i know of, there could be more) lies i believe within the jets in the other corner seat near the pumps. This one is real bad when the jets are on, I dont see any leaks when the jets are off, but i know that doesnt mean anything. So when i turn those jets on with contol system lever, and i have the motor compartment open, I notice a crap load of water build up around the light access in the back of the motor comaprtment. I then turn the lever so that the jets in the corner arent on and the water subsides. I know water is coming out of those jets all the time, but when the jet control lever is set to certain position it really flows out of there, thats when the leak seems at its worse. Can i assuem that those jets or the hoses leading to those jets are the culprit?
Any and all help is greatly appreciated. I think i have hit all problems that can be had with a hot tub, well not all I am sure, but quite a few. As I said earleir i got this tub for nothing so i didnt think 20 hours of digging and diagnosing and fixing and refilling would be that big of deal, and the tub was still well worth it. Just seems that there are so many things now that i have second guessed myself on the worth it part. If i get the moto massage going and fix the two known leaks, get the ozonator cleaned, get the heat fixed and the silent flo pump to not over heat, then i should be good to go. Just seems overwhelming. Right now though with the 100 degree weather, its been a great swimming pool for us!
Thanks again everyone and sorry its so lengthy but i wanted to get everything out there.
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John McLaughlin
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Post subject: Re: 2002 Hot Springs Sovereign: Pump/Heat Problems and leaks Posted: Wed Aug 06, 2008 10:53 am |
Joined: Mon Aug 04, 2008 12:58 pm Posts: 30
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Minor update: So i have been checking the water level twice a day and for the first two days it drained almost half the tub out. It now sits about half full and i dont think its moving. My idea is that i am going to get at all the hoses to all the jets that are above the water. Their should be maybe ten jets or so, but i gotta do it. I am also going to check the nipple in the moto massage as this sounds like a common leak spot.
I also got the ozonator to suck in the full bottle of vinegar. Still no bubbles and the heat pump still seemed a little hot and the water was still not heating up. I have since unplugged the tub and am planning on doing some major repairs over the next week.
I will update as often as i get something done and have a result to post.
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Dan.the.spa.man
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Post subject: Re: 2002 Hot Springs Sovereign: Pump/Heat Problems and leaks Posted: Wed Aug 06, 2008 10:24 pm |
Joined: Tue Jan 23, 2007 7:04 am Posts: 417
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Wow...you have a lot of info there. The biggest problem is probably the leak. The bank of ten jets is a common source for a leak. If the tub sat through a winter where the temp is below freezing, then those lines may have blown open. If not, there may be a glue-joint leak there, which was also a bit of a problem. Take off the composite slats and check it out with the tub running.
Sounds like the circ pump is shot as well. When these tubs sit empty for a while, the circ pumps don't fair so well.
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John McLaughlin
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Post subject: Re: 2002 Hot Springs Sovereign: Pump/Heat Problems and leaks Posted: Wed Aug 20, 2008 2:50 pm |
Joined: Mon Aug 04, 2008 12:58 pm Posts: 30
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OK so latest update. After many hours of digging i have found (I Hope) all the leaks. I dug out half of one side of the tub all the way to the top of each seat, so you could see all hoses and jets. I also dug out a little around where the pumps were because i had seen some water there. So got all that dug out, i bet it took oh half a day at least with a claw hammer and long huge flat bladed screw driver for the hard to reach areas. So i then tipped the tub back down and set it down on 8x8x16 cinder blocks 2 high. Proceeded to fill the hot tub and turn it on. Saw many leaks at the back of the seat that has ten precision jets in it. Saw one major leak over by the pump area and found out i had another cracked check valve. I have since then put in a new check valve. I have ordered the parts to replace the jet body of all ten precision jets in the one seat. I thought this would be much easier then trying to salvage the other jets, plus if i missed one that had a crack in it, it wasnt going to make me too happy. I also cleaned the back side of the shell of the hot tub where the jets were with a wire brush attatchment for my drill, this worked great! The parts came from Bakersfield CA to here in Lincoln Nebraska and will have taken no more then ten days, so thats not to bad. Like i said I ordered all ten precision jets, some clips for the cover and a few o rings for the jet bodies just in case i destroyed some taking the jets out. Oh one other thing the jet bodies of the precision jets all have an airline going into them as well. This was probably the most stressful part of the dig. I was told they would only be clamped to the jets but when i found them they were of course glued. I had to work at those lines pretty good to get them to come off without destroying them, ut got them without damaging a one, so thats good. So all in all it seemed pretty intimidating but i usually handle stuff like this pretty well, just had never done it before. Parts come in tomorrow for the precision jets so I will put those in and fill er back up and see what happens. Wish me luck!
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John McLaughlin
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Post subject: Re: 2002 Hot Springs Sovereign: Pump/Heat Problems and leaks Posted: Wed Aug 20, 2008 2:58 pm |
Joined: Mon Aug 04, 2008 12:58 pm Posts: 30
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Forgot one thing. I took apart the Circ pump and found what i believe to be nothiing wrong with it visually. The impeller was not stuck, it spun freely each time i spun it. I will have to do some other tests on it, when I get the tub filled back up and the pump put back in. The guy out in Cally told me it was probably the heater, the one i have (No-Fault Infinity heater looks like a bugle) apparently faults quite often. Any ideas for testing both the circ pump and heater to know if one or the other is failing would be greatly appreciated.
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John McLaughlin
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Post subject: Re: 2002 Hot Springs Sovereign: Pump/Heat Problems and leaks Posted: Mon Sep 08, 2008 4:02 pm |
Joined: Mon Aug 04, 2008 12:58 pm Posts: 30
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So another update is upon us. I have replaced all the mini-precision jets (10) in the back of one seat. I have replaced a second Check valve. Replacing the mini-prcision jets took some time, due to getting all the parts. Apparantly 3/8 pvc parts are hard to come by. I probably should have just ordered the T's and Elbows direct form a dealer, instead of trying to get the parts at a local plumbing store. So for those who are debating, make it easier on yourself and order the parts online somewhere. I only had one tiny tiny leak after putting in all the new parts. It was in an airline that went to one of the precision jets. It was located near the nipple that stuck out on the precision jet, where the air line attaches to. I had already used a clamp here, but couldnt get it to stop. So what i did was take a piece of 1/4" clear tubing and cut a piece about an inch long and put it over the tiny hole (Pin hole size). I then placed the clamp right in that area and voila! The leak was stopped. So no more leaks. So in all I replaced ten precision jets, two check valves and a few different odds and ends of pipe lengths and sizes. Last night I started filling the foam back in. Once i have that done I will set the tub back down and figure out my heating problem. I have on order 3 ceramic filters and one of the new circ pumps (E5) i beilieve it is, they shoudl be here tomorrow. I will install those and then see what happens with the heating side of the tub. If anyone ever has a question feel free to ask me, as i have seen and dealt with a lot on this tub.
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John McLaughlin
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Post subject: Re: 2002 Hot Springs Sovereign: Pump/Heat Problems and leaks Posted: Wed Sep 10, 2008 10:08 am |
Joined: Mon Aug 04, 2008 12:58 pm Posts: 30
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So i put the new filters in (which are very nice, if anyone is replacing theirs i would highly recommend the new ceramic ones) and i also installed a new E5 Circulation pump. Everything works great except for the heat. The bubbles are coming out of the floor drain again and i can actually hear the water circulating around the pipes in the heater/pump compartment. So now what? Is it the heater or is it the heater board, who knows? If anyone has any ideas please help me out, as i am punting, beings that its 4th and a mile. Edit: Is there anyway that its a High Limit Switch or anything like that. I mean it was def. having circulation problems before so that may have tripped at one point. Thing is, i dont know where any of these types of things are. I can see the reset button on the heater, but i push that and it does nothing. Anything else i can try?
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Dan.the.spa.man
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Post subject: Re: 2002 Hot Springs Sovereign: Pump/Heat Problems and leaks Posted: Wed Sep 10, 2008 2:34 pm |
Joined: Tue Jan 23, 2007 7:04 am Posts: 417
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You can test for voltage at the relay where the heater wires attach. Look for burn marks around this relay as well.
Also test the heater leads for continuity.
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John McLaughlin
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Post subject: Re: 2002 Hot Springs Sovereign: Pump/Heat Problems and leaks Posted: Wed Sep 10, 2008 2:42 pm |
Joined: Mon Aug 04, 2008 12:58 pm Posts: 30
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Testing where the heater wires attach at the relay is that on the main board or the heater board? I am not the one going to be doing it obviously, but i can visually inspect this stuff before a tech comes out. What about a high limit switch or any other resets i can look for? I got this tub from my dad who said the only issues he had with it before shutting it down one winter, were the leaks. Well it sat for probably a year before i got a hold of it. Not sure why the heater would go out in that time of just sitting there i guess. Who know. Thanks for the help Dan.
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John McLaughlin
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Post subject: Re: 2002 Hot Springs Sovereign: Pump/Heat Problems and leaks Posted: Wed Sep 10, 2008 10:47 pm |
Joined: Mon Aug 04, 2008 12:58 pm Posts: 30
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ok so i guess i was the one testing this stuff, lol. I found someone who had a volt meter. So i checked things out, had someone on the phone walking me through it, these are my results:
Jet Pump one Terminals read 121-122 with Jets on. Circ pump read 122 the ozonator read around 121 the heating board terminals for the wires that went to the heater read maybe 44. I did notice some burn marks on the front side of the board near where there are three oh inch by inch thingys? (Sorry just not sure what they are) I asked my dad about this and he said those were there when he had it, apparantly when the tech went to put the cover back on the iq2020 panel one of the screws touched the board and it sparked. Everything was tested after that and it still worked so i doubt that it means anything. Who knows. But the board could still be bad i am sure. As for the continuity of the leads i wasnt able to ohm those out as i didnt have time to tear the heater apart. If that is something important i could try it though. So is my board bad since it only reads at 44?
Thanks again for all the help
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