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Water Chemistry Questions

Spa Chemicals destroying plastic jets?

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Spa Chemicals destroying plastic jets?

Postby Dr. Evil » Mon Mar 22, 2004 12:49 pm

I have a year 2000 Dimension One spa that uses Waterway Jets.
Recently many of the jets have been popping out of the jet bodies due to a failure in the white plastic socket holder that keeps the jet locked into the jet body. Sorry if my terms are not quite right.

Anyway, this white plastic socket holder is just peeling apart like sheding skin. Is it possible that one of the chemicals I am using is causing this? Is there anything I can do to stop it?

It seems rather crazy that after only 3 years the jets are just falling apart due to this one piece of plastic. Of course you can't buy just this part you have to buy the while jet for about $14 each.

What to do?
Thanks in advance.
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Postby beanery » Mon Jun 28, 2004 2:13 pm

I have a Sundance Cameo with Waterway Jets and am having the exact same problem. I bought it in 2001 and its happening to me in 2004 (3 years, warranty was 2 years). I checked with the Sundance dealer and they have the jets (the entire jet with internal bearing part) for $14. Just like you, only the outer plastic piece is failing. It isn't flaking on mine yet, but it is a little pitted. :cry: It still has the plastic pieces that are supposed to latch, but they have thinned and won't hold. I told the dealer that they should be covered, but he won't do it (Sundance Spas in Austin). That's alittle ridiculous since I paid top dollar to get a Sundance because they used to be one of the top hot tubs out there. I guess they are making a profit now off their past reputation. My last spa lasted 13 years before things started breaking.

If anyone knows of a place to buy just the plastic insert and save some money, let me know. Or if you find a way to rig the old jets to work. Guess for now I'll buy a couple to get me though.
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Postby swbrains » Wed Oct 20, 2004 10:26 am

I have the exact same problem with my 3 year old Vita Spa -- again, a top-rated spa from what I had heard.

My jets are from Pentair and cost $20 each from the dealer or online. The dealer told me it was "chemical abuse" and replaced one for free, but I'll have to purchase the rest. I'm not buying it as I maintain my water very carefully. If anything, my pH *may* run a bit on the high side sometimes (7.8 - 8.0), but I never let it get below 7.2 for fear of corrosion, so I really don't feel it was chemical abuse.

Basically, I've come to find out that any wet part in the tub that fails is going to be called "chemical abuse" by the dealer to avoid warranty repairs. The same dealer told my neighbor the exact same thing when one of his jets started leaking around the seal -- must be "chemical abuse".

The main reason I don't feel it's chemical abuse is that the rest of the plastic on the jet (black jet face) is a much harder plastic and has no pitting or wearing at all. But the white-ish (more flexible) plastic barrel on the back of the jet has two "locking tabs" that have worn down and the plastic itself is no longer smooth, but pitted. I can see where it looks like chemical effects, but I've had 2 other tubs in the past 10 years and never saw this problem before and I've always maintained my spa water the same way. And why not make the barrel part in the back out of the same harder, stronger plastic as the front face which has had no ill effects from the water chemistry? Even the other plastic parts in the tub like the flter "door" area are fine and show no damage or pitting even though they are under water at all times. I really think it's substandard materials.

Here are some pictures of the Pentair "Cyclone" jets we have in our tub in case you're interested:
Image
Image

Here's a place that I found that has our jets (and other brands). I haven't purchased from them yet so I can't vouch for them, but they were nice enough to look at photos of my jets to tell me which ones were the correct replacements from their list. http://www.spacare.com/index.asp?PageAction=Custom&ID=36
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Postby techmps » Sat Mar 26, 2005 8:44 am

From 2001 we see many Pentair jets where the plastic neck of the jet becomes pitted, "chalky", brittle, thin, and flaky. It is obvious that sub-standard materials were used in their manufacture.

The jets in question have a "milky" look to the neck portion of the jet when new. Make sure the jets you buy/receive have a consistent opaque or clear quality to the plastic.

We sent some of these jets directly to technicians at a "Pac-Fab" facility. We never heard back from them.

Luckily, spa manufacturers will often send customers a new set of jets. If your dealers will not replace the jets, try contacting the spa manufacturer directly.

Good Luck
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Postby swbrains » Sat Mar 26, 2005 10:58 am

Thanks techmps. I'm glad to hear some confirmation for my suspicions.

It's funny you mention the different colors of the barrel plastic used in different versions of the jets. After I wrote to the BBB about the dealer and manufacturer. Then they sent a tech out to replace my jets for free. Although, the tech made a point to test the water again once he got here and got all up in arms over the fact that my pH was 8.0, TA was 120, and the pH was 0.5 ppm. Well, I had to explain to the tech that they (the dealer) had recommended Nature2, which I was using, and Nature2's own instructions said to keep only trace amounts (about 0.5 ppm) of chlorine in the tub. I also have an Ozonator (which this guy recently replaced when it died), which should also reduce the amount of chlorine needed for sanitization. 120 is also an acceptable TA as far as I know, and the manufacturers own web site "care tips" page said that the accpetable range for pH included 8.0.

They quoted all these test numbers when responsing to the BBB, and said I was taking terrible care of my tub! They are obviously looking for ways out of their warranty repairs.

In any event (long story long), when the tech did come out to replace the jets, he actually left me an extra jet (go figure). And, as you mentioned, a couple of them actually had the more clear-ish or opaque, but still somewhat translucent back (I noticed the difference when they were side by side on a table). I have to go check now to see what kind he actually put in the spa itself! :?

(Just checked -- luckily all the replacement jets appear to be the clearer/somewhat translucent plastic and not the milky white ones.)
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Postby MaxPower » Wed Sep 14, 2005 8:51 am

I have the exact same problem.

I have a Charisma spa with Waterway Storm jets. About 2 years old and all of the jets are starting to become brittle and break around the barrels. Charisma said this was calcium build up and not covered. But this isnt calcium buildup, this is the plastic itself deteriorating the same as the others have described. As well, there is no sign of calcium anywhere else on my spa. It is obvious that there are a batch of bad jets out there that no one wants to admit to or address. In any case this is a good reason to not buy a Charisma spa or any spa that uses Waterway jets. I am not spending $500 to replace every jet in my spa.
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Postby swbrains » Wed Sep 14, 2005 8:59 am

Wow, I was hoping Waterway wouldn't have that problem since they seem to be one of the other major manufacturers of jets and many spas I look at seem to use them.

Well, it's been about 6 months since the Pentair jets in my tub were replaced and the new ones are holding up much better (although I'm not sure 6 months is enough time to show damage). I am using Nature2 instead of bromine this time around, but I really don't think bromine should destroy jets if used in responsible dosages, so it's hard to say if it's the new plastic on the new jets or the Nature2 that's saving these jets.

Perhaps the manufacturers should just use stainless steel jets and be done with it! :P
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Postby formulaben » Tue Dec 19, 2006 6:05 pm

Has anyone been able to negotiate new jets due to this defect?
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Postby lieutenantglorp » Wed Mar 07, 2007 10:54 pm

formulaben wrote:Has anyone been able to negotiate new jets due to this defect?


Yes, if under warranty. See my post for some Waterway jet info.
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Postby formulaben » Thu Mar 08, 2007 1:13 am

Thanks!
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Postby formulaben » Tue Sep 11, 2007 9:32 pm

lieutenantglorp wrote:
formulaben wrote:Has anyone been able to negotiate new jets due to this defect?


Yes, if under warranty. See my post for some Waterway jet info.


Your post no longer exists. Any idea where I could find that information to forward it to another spa owner?
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Postby lieutenantglorp » Tue Sep 11, 2007 10:11 pm

quote]

Your post no longer exists. Any idea where I could find that information to forward it to another spa owner?[/quote]





Here are the ones for my spa:

http://www.spacare.com/index.asp?PageAc ... rodID=6534

http://www.spacare.com/index.asp?PageAc ... rodID=6536

[/url]
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Re: Spa Chemicals destroying plastic jets?

Postby MikeyM » Wed May 14, 2008 10:22 am

Hi
For the record. Coast Spas in Canada has the same issue. Have had the tub for 3 years now, when I purchased it I asked them about this issue (International pool and spa, the dealer) and they told me the issue was resolved. After year one (on Lithium) I wan into this problem. Flaking skin on the back of the jets turns into a chalky plastic over time that deteriorates. You end up with little white flakes in the tub at first. I had 60 jets to replace. After getting past the "poor chemistry " crap, by bringing in perfect water samples repeatedly, they finally agreed to replace the jet and acknowledged there was a problem. I took a year to get new jets as they kept sending them in little batches, giving some away to other customers. Some of the jets were Fiber optic types and they replaced the back portion only. The internal spinners were still the old style plastic. A year went buy and a month ago the fiber optic, clear plastic portion, separated from the bad plastic portion, so back the International I went and am in the process of replacing 10 of those. Finally all the jets are almost replaced and the new, darker, opaque cream colored like plastic is holding out like new. I wish the manufacturer of the jet would acknowledge the problem and not hide behind the poor chemistry excuse.

posting.php?mode=reply&f=2&t=116&sid=8f8d65d90af6e7c287e4d2edb31637f8#
:|
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Re: Spa Chemicals destroying plastic jets?

Postby coastspaowner » Wed Aug 13, 2008 5:52 pm

funny, for the record, I too have a coast spa and the guy in London, ON says it's water chemistry too....it's the party line. I asked the guy why only the tabs and inlet are deteriorating and not the part holding the silver jet and he couldn't answer the question. my tub is 5.5 yrs old and so it's out of warranty, three popped out last night and so i'm going to see what they are going to do about it.

I'd like to start a thread for just coast spa to see how wide spread the problem is...
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Re: Spa Chemicals destroying plastic jets?

Postby Avenger454 » Thu Sep 04, 2008 5:28 pm

Boy am I glad I found this forum. I have a thermospa tub, about 2 years old. Looks like it uses those same jets and has the same identical problems. I just got off the phone with customer service over a blower issue, after 15 minutes wanting to throw my phone across the room I didn't have the will to bring up the jet issue, knowing the response I would get.

Recently all the jets in the tub have started falling out with the same problem. Has anyone gotten the jet maker to fess up or am I looking at eating the cost of all the jets, or at least the internals?
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Re: Spa Chemicals destroying plastic jets?

Postby diggingnow » Fri Jan 09, 2009 10:47 pm

I have the same problem with my 3 year old LA Spa. I currently have 10 Jumbo Jet Diffusers that I have to replace and 10 mini diffusers. I just placed an order for $200.00 for just the diffusers (the plastic that holds the jets in). All of the plastic tabs have disinegrated and won't stay in. The dealer says they will send someone out to replace them but it's about $30.00 for each jet. No thanks. Is it the chemicals? I live in Las Vegas, so could it be the water or heat? The way I'm going now, I'll be replacing these annually. Does anyone know if Waterway is making a better part or can I replace these with other type jets? Thanks..
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Re: Spa Chemicals destroying plastic jets?

Postby lieutenantglorp » Tue Jan 13, 2009 12:01 am

diggingnow wrote:I have the same problem with my 3 year old LA Spa. I currently have 10 Jumbo Jet Diffusers that I have to replace and 10 mini diffusers. I just placed an order for $200.00 for just the diffusers (the plastic that holds the jets in). All of the plastic tabs have disinegrated and won't stay in. The dealer says they will send someone out to replace them but it's about $30.00 for each jet. No thanks. Is it the chemicals? I live in Las Vegas, so could it be the water or heat? The way I'm going now, I'll be replacing these annually. Does anyone know if Waterway is making a better part or can I replace these with other type jets? Thanks..
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Re: Spa Chemicals destroying plastic jets?

Postby dq72 » Sun Aug 09, 2009 7:17 pm

Just stumbled on this thread.
I have a Coast Spa "Manhattan" that is about 5 years old.
EXACT same issue. Waterway jets that deteriorated to powder.
The dealer replaced abut 10, then all of a sudden they had a sign up saying that they no loner replace any waterway jets under warranty as all jet issues are chemical related.
I have ordered the rest online and replaced them myself.
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Re: Spa Chemicals destroying plastic jets?

Postby BOOTSXI » Sun Oct 18, 2009 12:32 pm

Hello, I too have been having trouble with some waterway jets. The hot tub is about 8 years old and the jet have started to pop out and spilling the ball bearing into the tub. I have checked with the local dealer and was informed that waterway no longer makes that same jet. I would have to start replacing with other styles. Not really wanting to to that, just because a bearing failed, I searched the net and found replacement bearing for the jets at 14.00 each. But now my problem is how to get the new bearing fitted onto the stems in the housing, they seem to fit too tight to try to force them on. Was curious to see if anyone else had attempted to replace the bearing instead of the whole jet.
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Re: Spa Chemicals destroying plastic jets?

Postby lieutenantglorp » Sun Oct 18, 2009 6:59 pm

BOOTSXI wrote: But now my problem is how to get the new bearing fitted onto the stems in the housing, they seem to fit too tight to try to force them on. Was curious to see if anyone else had attempted to replace the bearing instead of the whole jet.


How much of a difference in size? Is this bearing to fit inside or outside the housing? You could try heating up one, and sticking the other in the freezer for a while (or vice versa depending on which one needs to be bigger/smaller) then try to mate them. This will only work if the size difference is small.
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